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Old 09-14-2009, 12:49 AM
Bihzad Bihzad is offline
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Lightbulb The problem with crafted items

Is that any major remort can use them regardless of their power level. This makes it possible for a very low rank to, in actuality, be very big and do stupid levels of damage. I've seen a 30k rank running around with 50k hps and doing above 10k a round.

How it might be fixed:

Why not make a "rank requirement" for each piece, based on its power level. For example:

<Crafted> Crazy Sword of Killing Things
Rank Cost: 35k

<Crafted> Mediocre Sword of Killing Things
Rank Cost: 15k

So, to use both weapons, you need a rank of at least 50k (the two above rank costs combined). Could also introduce the necessity to pick which crafts are most useful to you, based on the rank you've accumulated.

In any case, I kinda feel like they should have restrictions put on them in some way, even if some of the higher end eq is difficult to craft.
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  #2  
Old 09-14-2009, 10:13 PM
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grimm grimm is offline
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i kinda like the idea of it being able to use no matter your rank.

It gives the smaller players to catchup with the insanely big players.

Well if you compared a higher rank player with a lower rank player with both same crafted eq, definately a higher rank will still win. Thus, there's still the balance there.

If a small player can mange to craft better gear than a bigger rank, i think he deserves to be that buffed.
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Last edited by grimm; 03-10-2011 at 02:52 AM.
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  #3  
Old 09-15-2009, 11:42 AM
Odinn Odinn is offline
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/Agree with Izzral. While no one likes getting beat up by someone smaller than them or having them run faster- it helps the little people grow up quicker. Everyone has the same chance to wear crafted.
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  #4  
Old 09-15-2009, 06:27 PM
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Serenity Serenity is offline
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Bihzad, I wonder if you actually have a concept of just how hard it is to craft one of these so called OP items of craft? By hard I mean how much time and effort has to be placed into leveling craft abilities, how much time and effort a player has to put in running shit GPM areas to run materials, how many fails each one goes through trying to level himself?

No son you have no clue, cause if you did and had actually done it then you would not be so quick to seek 'more' restrictions on players.

Now I know you are going to come right back at me and say people do not need to go through all this to wear craft and that is true they just come to people like me and buy it, but that is an economic issue and not a crafting issue and so does not call for restrictions on crafting and of course you can not restrict free trade either... so back in your box with you and cry me a river.,
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Old 09-16-2009, 03:56 AM
Bihzad Bihzad is offline
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Serenity,

It was just a suggestion. Besides, I don't think the people I see running around with full sets of powerful crafted eq are newbs who are catching up, I think they're either alts or friends of bigger players, which doesn't really do much for newbs joining, who then use the pk system to target other people based on their rank, and get thoroughly beat up with no chance of winning. Anyway, you have much more experience with the mud than I do, so any "constructive" criticism of my thought process is welcome, but I suppose "dickish" criticism works too.
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Old 09-16-2009, 04:12 AM
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Serenity Serenity is offline
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Not sure I mentioned anything about noobs and the like so please address that to those who did and while at it insults will lead to one outcome!

Now back to the issue, I get a little sick of just about every post on this forum asking for someone or something to get toned and in many cases by people who have not put in the effort... see initial post.
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Old 09-16-2009, 05:27 AM
Whim Whim is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Serenity View Post
Not sure I mentioned anything about noobs and the like so please address that to those who did and while at it insults will lead to one outcome!

Now back to the issue, I get a little sick of just about every post on this forum asking for someone or something to get toned and in many cases by people who have not put in the effort... see initial post.
He was probably just a little offended at the tone of your reply, Serenity. I do notice a trend, intentional or otherwise, towards condescension to suggestions that probably discourages vocal contribution as much as any other factor. If we want discussion and improvement to take effect, we all need to take up the responsibility of fostering an environment which allows it.

To swing back to the original argument, I do agree with you to a point, Bihzad. I think rank would have been a good way of staggering access to the more powerful crafted equipment; however, that was not how it was implemented. Crafted gear has been around for about 2 years now, and over that time I have been extremely reluctant to make any significant changes to the system because of its nature - knowledge, research, and experience all make for a far more effective crafter, and I don't want to upset that foundation too much.

There are a few imbalances in the system (e.g., speed scaling), but I think it has for the most part held up quite well over time. I do want to address the imbalances, but I will not do so as a stopgap measure. Rather, addressing any imbalance will come when I am ready to seriously address crafting with an upgrade.

Either way, I do not plan on adding restrictions to base (current) crafting recipes. These will always be available as "crafted gear for everybody". Rather, I currently plan to implement the following as a focused development unit:
- Enhance crafting dialogues for speed and safety.
- Fix the long-standing bug which homogenizes crafting results on any item with wood as its primary material (thus greatly expanding wood-based options).
- Tweak any stat ratios that need it (probably just speed).
- Revise the material NPC trading system (Gerahf).
- Implement the first set of crafting specializations.
- Implement enhanced (new) crafted gear recipes, based on specializations and new materials. Here, I will explore the possibility of adding rank-limitations to this new gear (only).

Thus, these necessary imbalance and bug fixes will come in the form of a package upgrade (over time, of course), rather than isolated nerfs which people tend to resent. Current gear will remain unchanged, except in the case of tweaked stat ratios (which, as I mentioned, I have refrained from touching for the past two years), and no restrictions will be added. New materials will be a part of the new content as I introduce it (Invasion, Scar, Ramparts, Trials).

Anyway, that's the plan as it stands. I'll talk about it a little more on the 6S blog, when it's time. =) Thanks for your suggestions!
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Old 09-16-2009, 05:28 AM
Bihzad Bihzad is offline
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I have nothing against you, but this:
Quote:
so back in your box with you and cry me a river.,
wasn't necessary. I was just offering a suggestion from my perspective. I'm more than willing to admit I could be way off.

I just think it's strange that permanent eq has restrictions while crafted eq doesn't. I understand crafted eq can be a pain in the ass to make, but good su eq can be a pain in the ass to find, and su eq is in many cases less powerful than crafted eq, and it has restrictions. Anyway, most people seem to prefer it this way, and that's fine by me. Just wanted to start a discussion.

Ah, Whim caught me in mid-reply. Thanks for the informative response. Much appreciated.

Last edited by Bihzad; 09-16-2009 at 05:31 AM.
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  #9  
Old 09-16-2009, 05:56 AM
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grimm grimm is offline
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i see what you mean with your comparison with permanent eq and crafted.

Well yes crafted eq has now outweigh permanent SU; but then crafteds fade and permanents don't.

The drawback of having crafted is taking weeks to craft a good item and to have it fade in 70days ish? I think that is a fair trade off.

Plus eq structure has been in the mud forever whereas crafted is new. Both item are in too seperate worlds and should be just compared easily.
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Last edited by grimm; 03-10-2011 at 02:52 AM.
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  #10  
Old 09-17-2009, 02:23 AM
Argh Argh is offline
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actually...i'm gonna have to disagree with whim's idea on this one =/
i don't see the reason in tweaking the speed stat on items...it's basically the fighter classes equivalent of casters willpower eq...sure you get fighters running around with 20 odd attacks nowadays but they've still gotta have a decent hit/dam to make up it work...what about casters (*cough*warlocks) stacking willpower and knocking their buffs, spell damage and NR up to some really nifty amount??? (gonna start pickign on warlocks now so serenity..just ignore this part! :P) as if it's not bad enough already without buffs, warlocks have a buff that gives them more NR than most fighters would ever have (reign of resist)...dish out 2k over damage per wrinkle on players (with time bending that 2-3 a round)...tank like a tank (obvious pun intended)...and still hit harder than most fighters would!! (i still can't get a grip on this one)...
(ok serenity, you can read now :P) to get the speed scaling right, there's a lot of defense which has to be given up...and from a pk point of view, the stronger defense is always gonna win (yay for willpower/hps or agi/hps eq?)
someone's gonna tell me to stop whining and go warlock soon enough :P

p.s. i still don't understand why it's willpower and not constitution that increases natural resistance =/
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